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Torrence’s Take On The Ambassador “Situation”
Published by Torrence Glenn on Tuesday, May 19, 2009 at 12:58 pm.
Before I begin, I’d like to say that this situation is a perfect example of why so many people are jaded and/or can’t be bothered with “church.” You’ll see what I mean.
Now let me be clear, I’m really not all that into gospel rap, holy hip hop, or whatever else we’re calling it these days. I HAVE NO ISSUES with it whatsoever, it’s just not MY thing. The same holds true for my mainstream music choices, I’m just a soul/r&b kind of guy in general. (I say this, because I know some people take issue with gospel music sounding too “secular/worldly”, etc. and I don’t have those issues.) But I do, however, think it has a place in music and gospel and really do appreciate it; which is why I’m addresssing this.
The Ambassador (Watch him talk about Sunday Best audition videos here.) s a gospel rapper many of you may be familiar with. He’s one of the more popular rappers in the genre and is a part of Cross Movement Records, that I guess could be compared to a gospel version of Def Jam. Actually, let me correct myself. He WAS signed to Cross Movement Records. They’ve since dropped him from the label. Why? Over some “church folk foolishness!” Last night I stumbled on an article over at Gospel Spectrum about The Ambassador being dropped from his contract along with excerpts of an open letter from the label and thought: “This must be a joke. This is probably another internet rumor.” So I went to Cross Movement’s website and sure enough, there it was. So I read the whole letter and was still left shaking my head. You can read the whole thing here, but I’ll pull out the “good parts” for you. Actually, I’m not even sure whether he’s dropped or not because the words used in the label’s statements are rather vague. So as the story goes, supposedly The Ambassador has cheated on his wife. Yes, I’d have to agree that that’s not a good thing. I’ll even go as far to say that cheating on your wife is, ummm, WRONG. There, I said it. Now that that’s out of the way, let’s get to it.
“Dear Body of Christ,
It is with much grief, severe disappointment and an overwhelming fear of the Lord that Cross Movement Records is sad to announce that we will be discontinuing the forwarding and promotion of the Artist and Minister, The Ambassador AKA William “Duce” Branch, due to recent findings of moral failure in his marriage.”
Dramatic much? It is with an overwhelming eye-roll that I read that first sentence. If The Ambassador did in fact cheat on his wife, I’m sure she’s probably got the market cornered on grief and “severe disappointment.” You, Cross Movement, are simply disappointed. Get a grip!
“It is CMR’s past, current and prayerfully, future position that living in moral compromise is unacceptable and never allowable in the lives of any of the ministers that we co-labor with.
Although it is a rare find these days, discipline is still one of the true marks of the true Church.
That being said, we also know according to Hebrews 12:6 that “whom The Lord loves He disciplines.” So we know that our beloved brother Duce is under the Lord’s loving care (Hebrews 12:5-11).”
These last few lines probably aggravate me the most. Now don’t get me wrong, I believe in correction and discipline with the best of them, but just as the scripture in Hebrews they so eloquently referenced says, moral discipline comes from God, not you or in this case, a record label. But you know what? I can see how they would think that’s cool. As a choir director and growing up in the church, I’ve had to deal with various members of one of my choirs having to be “sat down” because they were pregnant or had fathered a child. And depending on what type of church you went to, he or she may have even been made to ask for forgiveness from the church in the form of a letter or speech in order to come back or participate again. This ALWAYS bothered me. Not only because I felt it was slightly embarrassing and unnecessary, but a bit hypocritical and unfair. Firstly, Shanquita (fake name) didn’t sin against me or you, she sinned against God and herself. Secondly, EVERYONE makes mistakes and commit sins of some kind everyday, it kind of goes with that whole being human and imperfect thing. BUT, we (the church or the gospel industry) many times have the nerve to think it is our place to discipline someone else for a select number of sins only because they have visible consequences. For example, nobody sat down all the various people betting busy in the choir, just the ones who got pregnant, because they had walking proof. The letter goes on to say:
I guess this one issue just goes and throws all the work he’s done over the years out the window, huh? I give Cross Movement a little bit of credit though. If anything, you can’t call ‘em “wishy washy.” Ha! That’s their story and they are sticking to it. I’m glad though, that not all gospel labels are this way. There have been other well known artists who have had to deal with similar circumstances recently and they’re still signed to their labels and have projects albums coming out soon, that in all honesty, I hope you support. Kind of hard to get your testimony out there with no way for anyone to hear it, because your record label is afraid of real life. I wish the Ambassador the best and hope everything works out!
Just my take, what’s yours?
I’m out!
Torrence
The foolishness exhibited on this blog post is saddening. Thank you brother Tony for posting this:
“The thoughts represented on this blog shows how far the American church has gotten away from Biblical Christianity.”
Torrence, adultery isn’t simply “wrong” it is a grievous sin, so bad that Christ himself said if you are inflicted by it, you should gouge out your eye (figuratively speaking). The Ambassador is blessed to have people in his life that will provide honest accountability to him. When we sin, and we all do, having loving fellow believers who will step in and help us return to full submission to the Lord is a good thing.
I am just going to say this Ambassador was a good rapper and i had all of his CDs and I lik how CMR handled the situation because people who do not kno christ and see that he can do this and still be in ministry they will fall back. And as a christian you do not want that. But my boy Lamar is speaking the Truth… And man DONT THE TRUTH SUPPOSED TO HURT??? So this Terrence guy didnt like this because it was the TRUTH!!! And nobody commented on that Rick Ross STUFF because its NOT THE TRUTH!!! All this secular rap and people sayin its the TRUTH trust me if it was people would have a problem with it!!! But they dont because this music they playin is bringin our race down everyday but nobody wants to HEAR THAT because it is the TRUTH!!!! Like me boy Black Ice said TOOK ALL OUR MESSENGER MADE THEM RAPPER AFFRIAD TO ADMIT THEIR TREASEN!!! But they have a problem with CMR releasing him and this dude doing this said he dont even listen to it!!! CRAZY
How bout you write on a story of how this secular rap is messin up the minds of or young people PLEASE!!!
1 Corinthians 5
1.It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father’s wife.
2. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
3. For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
4. In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
5. To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
6. Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
This is why one must be corrected, because if one do it, its like a door is left open to anyone to do so when the Church is not being guided by the Holy Spirit. Yes, such sin as this requires to be dealt with according to how Paul responded, simply because the who PURPOSE is so that their soul may be SAVE! So when a Pastor have to discipline he must do it in Love not in Revenge because his prayer should be to that he will repent and return, but how will the Pastor receive him in open arms if he spoke, react in revenge.
I understand that this is a Blog which requires opinions, but when dealing with Brothers & Sisters in Christ you must speak with all meekness & LOVE…… I can understand why CMR responded the way they did because it isn’t something to Glory in, and must be dealt with love & truth, all other can be spoken face to face. Ya’ll be Bless, but if you are under the Truth… APPLY it, so you may Grow thereby… Mildred
Just hold it one minute, I commend the Ambassador’s church, CMR, and Amba himself for the way they are handling this. It’s actually the right way of doing this. I have told the congragation that if I where found cheating or if I did cheat – I would immediately need to sit down. When the Book talks of not judging people – its talking about stating the eternal fate of someone – we are however, charged to call right – right and wrong – wrong. That’s what CMR did and they are working on restoration, no different from Tru-life, Cruz Cordero, or Timothy Brindle of LampMode. These branches of HHH can teach the gospel music industry a few things – oops I forgot – its about record sales over there. At least in CMR, Reach, Lampmode – they truly practice what they preach.
This was way too much to read! I did catch a little of the arguement though. The cat talking about LIFT EVERY VOICE needs to start a new blog. We have a topic here.
Ok, I knew about the “moral failure” before the statement came out aaaaaaaallllllllllll the way here in Texas. How much more do you think the news spead in New York, New Jersey, Massachusetts and definately Pennsylvania? With Duece being a rap luminary, he has a lot of people’s attention. Let’s say that nothing is said about situation. It will look to those that straddle that this is a normal church occurence. That’s why we have behaviors in the church now that are contrary to GOD’s will. Please don’t think I’m trying to blast the Catholics, but were they wrong to come out and make a statement on the molestation that happened? *Oh, yes, because that involved underaged children!* Ok, now, what about other divergent behavior that goes against the church involving consenting adults?
The prior incidents that someone commented on earlier did not happen to Enock, who it was told left to be with family, only to show up in Houston on another label. It was Cruz Cordero that was sat down at the same time as Tru LIFE. Oh, and who said they’ve listened to Cross Movement for years but refered to him like he is some vague character? Laughable! He’s produced tracks on almost everything the company has put out. He only missed HUMAN EMERGENCY. Yea, you’re a fan. By the way, when those three guys left, who penned the realease- DUUUUUUUECE!
I like the fact that they are holding a standard. I think about one of the two brothers I was ordained with. Thanks to GOD’s mercy and grace, one is making a comeback from a fall. The three of us are tight as skin on an anorexic chick. Although we love him, while he is in his current state we can’t have him up before the people. That’s in the local church. Do you want names like Jakes, Zecchariah, Stanley, Price, Washer, Morton or Jones doing there thing on the side still up in the pulpit. Those in the ministry ARE held to a higher standard by GOD. Our co-laborers are there to help us not get so far from the FATHER that we think sin is OK.
What is the big deal with calling adultery a “moral failure?” See, the desire to sugar coat things has made the church lose it;s potency. We’ve embraced mediocracy soooooo much and made the Gospel not tooooooo offensive that our congregants are like the newly released Israelites from Egypt- they still held on to the double-minded practice of worshipping a lil sinny sin sin. It’s alright, GOD will forgive. NOT WITHOUT TRUE REPENTENCE!
the fact that Ambassador was a leader puts his business in the public eye, which he knew before hand. everything about infidelity is a conscious decision. the fact that he was corrected in the public eye was only a natural result since the act itself was known openly in high church before this statement was released.
some may view this as drastically different but the issues we’ve seen committed by some priests, when children bring their molestation/ sexual abuse to light by these leaders, but those acts were brushed under the rug in order to keep ‘order’ or to protect the image of those priests or those churches, meanwhile more children were getting sexually abused. so we have to have discernment about what things to make known and what things to keep private, especially when our leaders need correction. to place so much fault on cmr and not take into account the conscious decision making that goes into infidelity–pastor or not, saved or not, leader or not–that’s heavy.
I think what was done was fair. We never know though, they might pick him back up and this could be temporary after he takes time to restore himself, his family, and then he might be ready to step back into leadership
Its not really hypocritical if he step down. They have to relieve him for a while. you know how church is. how would you react if a preacher that is preaching to your kids cheated on his wife the week before. he would at least have to step down for a while because this can become a stumbling block to others. new believers who first reaction when looking at this can be “oh this guy cheated on his wife and he still out here trying to preach to me about being faithful. church folks are such hypocrites” I know you’ve heard this saying plenty of times from either non-believers or new believers. 2 Thess 3:6-14 speaks of the process of disciplining and related to this subject is 1 Corinthians 5. the bible speaks clearly on discipline and cmr took the right actions. when ambassador is good then they can restore him.
Thank God we have the Gospel “according” to Matthew, Mark, Luke and John as our standard and not “man’s”. I’m not for hypocrisy, judgement that comes from man or hidden sin but it just seems to me that Christians are so tolerant of sin! You’re right you will “sin everyday” if you are tolerant of it! Has nothing to do with being human because Jesus was human and he sinned not! Ok, yeah i know i’m not Jesus… but he was perscuted, crucified , shed his blood, rose again and died for me to be perfect. I will press toward that mark daily and make no excuses for my flaws (i’m just human…lol)! The church just needs to stand up and be the church (live right and be bold about it), we look too much like the world. When God corrects us he usually uses a man to do it (that’s why we have Apostles, Prophets, Pastors, Evangelists and Teachers). It’s just the way we set it up. No sense in crying over what went wrong. It’s just time to repent, receive your forgiveness and get back into your righteousness. I’m so tired of hearing excuses for doing wrong (we all have done wrong), the bottom line is that Jesus did “Right ALL the time” and he is our example and He’s coming back for a church without spot or wrinkle. Selah.
I love Duce. He has sinned… Discipline does come from God, however, how many times did God use other nations and people to exact that discipline in Scripture. William is being disciplined in the same manner in which I have heard him preach over the years and I pray that his restoration as a husband, father, and follower of Christ is the same as he preached as well.. Sorry folks…its not about the music, its about the ONE who gave him the gift and the platform to begin with….
The sin which was within has just manifested outwardly…Jesus said that whoever looks at a woman and lust for her in his heart has already committed adultery…I say this to myself as well as any others who have been tempted to ever look in lust…sin will not stop…every lusting thought would be the most foulest of fornication if sin could have its way….what was in the dark has just made itself manifest in the light…and I fully agree with Matthew 18:15-20…get it right while its in the dark, or it will be brought to the light…I do pray for Ambassador, I do pray for all of Christian Hip-hop….im not a big fan of it, namely because when you emulate the tree of Hip-hop, youll reap its fruits….while some of it is doctrinally sound and has great lyrics, the bottom line is…why not just preach the gospel like everyone else in the Bible? why do we need all of this “modern day ‘expression of myself’”?
Discipline does come from God, but there must be order in the body of Christ…you dont just hide your bleeding leg when its injured…you clean the wound and sew it back up…no matter how painful it is…thats what we do in the body of Christ….
when a sin such as adultery deserves death by stoning according to the law of Moses and deserves hell according to the mouth of Jesus…is it too harsh to stand a brother up in front of a congregation of people and tell him to step down and repent? Its honestly grace that God didnt leave “Duce” alone to die in his sin, but convicted him and brought his sin to the open so that he might repent, correct it and live…
no one should judge ambassador according to men’s standards, because we all are guilty of sin, and we all should be amazed that our hidden sins didnt hit the light this morning…what we must do is judge by the standards of scripture and from there youll know a tree by its fruit….
I do believe my brother is saved, and I do believe that if he is, God
WILL bring him out of this through granting him repentance because those whom He saves He keeps until the end and none shall pluck them out of His hand….may God recieve all the glory in Ambassadors life, and may His Sovereign grace rest over Ambassador and His family….
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people are Human….we all make mistakes…responsibility takes action…my bro ambassador is a gospel hiphop icon….i look up to him……..and just like most characters in the bible…..all have sinned and fallen short…….but he is a role modle…..his life is set on stage…..so sow in the flesh you will reep the flesh……i PRAY for you bro….may all things work according to GODs will……in the meen time those who read this…—>take inventory of YOUR life……myspace-/-1youngpro
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sin is sin…tell a lie den ur no betta than the adultary…thats the issue we have as christians…STOP LOOKING AT PEOPLE “HUMANS” AS GOD!!! I EXPECT HUMANS 2 MESS BC THEY R HUMAN. IF ANY OF THESE PEOPLE WHO DISAGREE WITH Torrence Glenn HAVENT SINNED IN THE PAST WEEK DEN WHT THEY R SAYN IS TRUTH!!!IF NOT SHUT UP LOL…GOD GIVES PEOPLE GIFTS PEOPLE USE THEIR GIFTS 2 HELP OTHERS..NOT TO GET GLORY BC THT BELONGS 2 GOD. SO IF U PUT AMBASSADOR OR CMR ON A PEDDLE STOOL AND DEY LET U DOWN U DESERVE IT BC U SHUD HV BEEN PUTTING GOD ON DAT PEDDLE STOOL NOT MAN
For those of you who think CM was brash or out of line they are not, they are remaining consistant. If you know the history of CM this sort of thing happened with Cruz Cordero and another member of the group. At that time it was Ambassador who wrote the letter. Because he was a founding member and was there when they decided how this sort of things would be handled, he knew what was coming. I am a huge fan of Duce as a rapper and a pastor but I just wanted to make that point. I honsetly pray for him, his family and the congregation at Epiphany. They all will be effected by this and need God’s support and the support of the body of Chirst.
Ambassador has been dropping some extremly hard core, no compromise lyrics for over a decade. He has climed to the pinnacle of proclaming what is right from wrong in his music…that is a major force underlying lots of his lyrics. Now, he is being dealt with in the same hard core, no room for milk kinda way his ministry is delivered. I know that God will be fair to Him and will have mercy on him, even when others won’t. However, he has got to face the consequences, albeit those consequences are as powerful and no joke as the lyrics infused in his songs.
i look at it like this..God sent his son to die for the thing that ambassador did..but at the same time Romans 8:1 CLEARLY SAYS THAT THERE IS NOW NO CONDEMNATION TO THOSE THAT ARE IN CHRIST..IN THAT BEING SAID GOD FORGIVES AND SO SHOULD WE DO THE SAME..I THINK ITS A GROWTH STAGE THATS GOING ON WITH HIM BECAUSE HE HAD TO HUMBLE HIMSELF AND ACCEPT ALL CONSEQUENCES THAT CAME ALONG WITH HIS ACT!!..I JUST WISH US AS PEOPLE WOULD SEE OUR OWN FAULTS BEFORE WE GO BASHING SOMEONE ELSE!!!!!
TO THE WHOLE CROSS MOVEMENT..PROVERBS 27:17 LETS SHARPEN ONE ANOTHER!!!
Mr. Glen, the truth about the Lords word is that it applys to ALL. Clearly, Duce needs help, yet, those who judge rather than pray can also find themsleves in the same trap. Please allow Yeshua (Jesus) into your heart, and step from behind the ink pen and embrase HIM. Much Love…B.E.V.
Mr. Glenn,
I’m real sorry for your church expieriences I do agree that making someone publicly admit their in front of a choir is wrong, but this is totally different. By your own admission you admit you’re not ver familiar with CrossMovement records,so you probbably don’t understand that they view what they do as ministry and hold themselves to a higher standard. Unlike most secular driven Gospel music in the sense that it’s driven by the dollar it’s like comparing apple and oranges and they are two diifernt things. So to the Believer it makes absoulute sense.
I would challenge you in your spare time to read the teachings of Jesus in the Gospels, and or read the letters of Paul to see how addressed churches to see how CMR came to their conclusions. I do agree that many choirs do overlook the fornication that could be going on, and that is wrong and should be addressed by the leaders of that church Lord willing they hold to a Biblical standard.
Mr. Glenn I have already, and will continue to pray for you as you are the voice to so many young people who hold your words as truth. (Like it or not you are the only spiritual guide some people may know) I pray that not only are you and Jesus straight but that the wisdom of the Holy Spirit will guide you in all you do and for God to protect you and your family.
Grace and Peace
Oh and yungsemaj you are totally taking Romans 8 out of context read the whole letter ask your youth pastor or someone who has read the Bible because that is not at all Paul is implying.